Truly anonymous way to convert fiat money to BTC and vice versa?

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Truly anonymous way to convert fiat money to BTC and vice versa?

  • Stephen Davis

    Is there a truly anonymous way to convert fiat money to BTC and vice versa? Help is much appreciated.

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  • Anonymous

    https://anarplex.net/hosted/files/secondrealm/secondrealm.html

     

    Yeah- they’re hardcore.

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    Stephen Davis

    I just watched an interview with Smuggler (Anarchast, Episode 50) and he said that he supports Bitcoin and uses it a lot, but:

    (1) It can be taken down.

    (2) It can be controlled.

    (3) It is not anonymous.

    That interview was from December 2012, so perhaps something has changed? I’ve heard about Dark Wallet and the concept behind it sounds interesting, but I’m still puzzled by whether it’s possible to truly use BTC anonymously.

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      Anonymous

      Whoops, I was typing my reply before I saw this. Yes, it’s very true that you can follow the BTC exchanges from one wallet to the next. You can take steps to avoid associating your real identity with your wallet (your primary wallet shouldn’t be the one in your social profiles and never let your meatspace wallets touch your “other wallets”). In the end if someone or something with massive amounts of resources and time wants to find you out 100% it will be difficult to keep everything anonymous. Compartmentalize as much as you can (separate computers, burner phones, never use wifi at home for BTC business, etc, etc).

      Of course as always, by the time I have thought or typed any of this it is all outdated and irrelevant.

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    Anonymous

    Oops. Although that is a nice link and all I can’t find what I was intending to post. There is more material out there about washing BTC, buying BTC in person to use only in person, there’s that Dark Wallet thing now, also you could mine BTC to use in ways not associated with your identity.

    Also, you can start with no fiat money and just get a wallet to receive BTC for work done without ever linking it with an online trading platform. In a sense you have the Mr. Smith that works in transfers and pays taxes but Mr. Smith also does Latin tutoring on the side as well as house repair and only accepts BTC for his services. Use those BTC to buy other goods and services without ever transferring them into fiat currencies.

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    Stephen Davis

    Yes, I think you are hitting on a key strategic point: go around the state’s fiat. Work for BTC, trade with BTC, and make the state irrelevant. I can support that.

    The thing is, I’ve been hip to BTC for years, I’m computer savvy, etc., and I have serious concerns about the anonymity aspect.

    Can I truly protect myself from the state? If so, what are the best resources for learning how to do so?

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    Kwashiorkor

    Use products as the interchange between $ and btc, using a service like this:

     

    http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/apr/30/silk-road-darkmarket-openbazaar-online-drugs-marketplace

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    Scott

    Stephen asked: “Can I truly protect myself from the state? If so, what are the best resources for learning how to do so?”

    Since states cover the planet, there really is no way to completely protect yourself against them. The best you can do is to minimize their impact on you. If this is a top priority for you, you will avoid socialist countries like the US or most of Western Europe, and move to relatively capitalist countries where governments tend to leave people alone. In South America Chile may be a good choice. In Central America Mexico is also not too bad. Much of Asia also qualifies, especially China, which is the most capitalist “large country” in the world today.

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      Stephen Davis

      Scott, thanks for your thoughts. My question is specific to BTC and being able to use it truly anonymously.

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    Scott

    You pose a good question. And I think that the answer is important.

    I think my answer also applies to bitcoin. Within the context of the type of Big Brother technology which has been implemented in the socialist part of the world, it is fairly adventurous to believe that any type of transaction can be consistently kept “anonymous”. This includes transactions in bitcoin, litecoin or whatever. It is a fact that 99% surveillance is no longer a long-term goal; on the contrary, it is today’s reality. To rely on the remaining 1% that is not yet stored in the NSA’s data library is simply not a good bet. To be clear: the “1%” wiggling room still exists. But unless you have access to some very authoritative insider information, to believe that you will be able to detect exactly where exactly that wiggling room is sounds to me like wishful thinking.

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    Gabriel Bärwald

    Bitcoin in pseudo-anonymous meaning that you can be completely anonymous if you wish to be. In order to do that you have to acquire the Bitcoins in your wallet without the means of a Fiat to Bitcoin transaction. Such as sites like coinbase. However if you have the Bitcoins transferred into your account that isn’t linked to yourself then you are anonymous. So long as you do not transfer those coins back into Fiat. So in short no there ins’t a way to convert from Fiat to BTC anonymously, however that is not set in stone. People are always working on new ways to improve the security and anonymity of the coin.

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      Dave Burns

      there ins’t a way to convert from Fiat to BTC anonymously,

      Well, there is, but the feds would probably consider at least one of the participants in the transaction to have broken the law. And they would have to trust each other a lot, despite being perfect strangers. So perhaps it would be fair to say there is no reasonable way to convert fiat to BTC anonymously.

      Exercise for the interested reader: zero-knowledge proof of “I am not a cop.”

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    wolske

    You could remain anonymous in a face-to-face cash transaction; obviously you may be physically identifiable by the other party, but if they don’t take down your name/details then there would be no paper-trail leading back to you. LocalBitcoin also describes a process for depositing cash to a bank account and having the BTC sent to you; this would take the face-to-face aspect out of it, but requires a level of trust that the deposit would be honored.

    Or did I misunderstand the question?

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    Alva Cottingham

    Yes its possible. It’s a pain though. http://anonymousbitcoinbook.com/

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